# [SciPy-user] sine transform prefactor

Ivo Maljevic ivo.maljevic@gmail....
Mon Jul 28 09:07:33 CDT 2008

I do not know about cosine transform much as I do not use it, but the
coefficient 1/(2pi) in
the continuous time Fourier transform is not something that is quite
randomly selected (even though, I admit, in calculating discrete FT
you have more freedom at choosing the scaling factor, and sometimes
for reasons of symmetry there is a 1/sqrt(N) scaling factor in both
directions).

Using latex, you either have completely symmetric expressions if one
uses 'f' frequency:

X(f) = \int_{-\infty}^{\infty} x(t)\ e^{- i 2\pi f t}\,dt,
x(t) = \int_{-\infty}^{\infty} X(f)\ e^{i 2 \pi f t}\,df,

or if you use angular frequency  ω=2 pi f, than you have:

X( ω) = \int _{-\infty}^\infty x(t)\ e^{- i ω t}\,dt

x(t) = \frac{1}{2\pi} \int _{-\infty}^{\infty} X( ω)\ e^{ i ω t}\,d ω,

Not that this will be of much help to Lubos. Lubos, you may want to
look at the following Wiki page, or if you are still not happy, I will
dig up my literature and find out more about DCT. You are probably

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrete_cosine_transform

and you might want to look also at:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrete_Fourier_transform

Ivo

2008/7/26 Frank Lagor <dfranci@seas.upenn.edu>:
> Ludos,
>
> First let me clarify: the factor in front of the continuous forms is
> 1/sqrt(2pi), not sqrt(2/pi) like I said previously (I was confused).
>
>>
>> if i do
>> iDST(DST(f(r))
>> on discrete data, i get the original data back (expected result). this
>> would indicate that
>> 1) either the sqrt(2/pi) norm shouldn't be used for discrete data (why?)
>
>
> I don't think the factors should be added on at all.  The mere transform and
> invtransform functions should handle all factors.  This is related to what I
> want to type later on.
>
>>
>> 2) the sqrt(2/pi) factor is taken care of somewhere inside the DST
>> function (how?)
>
> Yes. It should be.  Like I said before, the convention chosen doesn't really
> matter as long as the you do the FT and then the IFT, because the factors
> from the two operations must multiple together to give 1/(2pi) in the end
> (this is built into the answer.  The problem with convention only comes when
> you want to compare numbers of transformed data (still in fourier space)
> with someone else.  Then you need to know if your conventions are the same.
>
>>
>> this is the thing i'd really love to know - is the answer 1 or answer 2
>> correct?
>
> I think the actual answer lies in the fact that the fourier transform is
> actually derived from the fourier series.  The fourier series is a sum of
> some coefficients times an exponential. There is an equation for calculating
> these coefficients and it is something like 1/(2pi) times an integral, and
> thats where the 1/(2pi) comes in (actually it comes in when the formula for
> the coefficients is derived).  See the book Functions of a complex variable
> by Carrier, Krook, and Pearson for the details of this derivation.  I think
> that if you see this, all your concerns about the factors will be taken care
> of.
>
> -Frank
>
>
> --
> Frank Lagor
> Ph.D. Candidate
> Mechanical Engineering and Applied Mechanics
> University of Pennsylvania
>
>
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