[SciPy-dev] problems with numpy.setuptools...

David Cournapeau david@ar.media.kyoto-u.ac...
Fri Sep 28 22:49:53 CDT 2007

Stefan van der Walt wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 28, 2007 at 09:26:53AM +0200, Pearu Peterson wrote:
>>> should be in the release, we should remove it from SVN.
>> I think issuing such warnings is useful for developers as
>> quite often one writes a code into a big system without being
>> able to test the code with all practical corner cases.
>> numpy.distutils is an example.
>> So, this kind of a warning is like a mild assertion failure
>> that should draw other developers attention that the code
>> might do (or not do) something that is different what they
>> have assumed. But the code will still run. If nobody will see
>> the warning, then the new code is (may be) safe. If other developers
>> see the warning then that means that they should work together
>> to remove the cause of possible issues from the start.
>> Given issue is a prefect example of this kind of situation
>> that captures possible problems in the development state
>> rather than from users feedback that may have very long
>> time span.
>> I think we should practice this kind of warnings more often.
>> When making a release, such warnings should be disabled
>> (read: removed when the issue is resolved).
> I would prefer if numpy were *always* in a release-ready state.  Why
> can't we instrument tests for distutils?  If the code is so confusing
> that we can't test it (or "practical corner cases"), should we be
> using it as a core ingredient in the first place?
I think part of this issue is related to the source control system we 
are using. My impression is that with the current system, having always 
something at least buildable in the trunk and usable is preferable; with 
a better source constrol system, we would not have such a problem, or at 
least would make the problem less pervasive (we would not need to work 
directly in the trunk so often).

Now, concerning the build tool itself: testing build tools is inherently 
difficult; This is similar to why cross compilation is inherently 
difficult: the platform to build the build tool and the platform to test 
it are different. Replacing "everything" with scons (or any other tool) 
is non trivial, and will take some time. I think it worths it, because 
IMHO, distutils has fundamental design flaw wrt our needs in numpy/scipy 
(see my answer to Pearu in the same thread).


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